APOSTLE JOHN MAY NEVER HAVE DIED

"John must prophesy again..."

APOSTLE JOHN MAY NEVER HAVE DIED

Postby lastday on Fri Jun 06, 2008 2:00 pm

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The Apostle John May Never Have Died (Continued from Two Endtime Prophets)

*The Orthodox Church has always believed that John never died. John returned to Ephesus and stayed in the house of Domnus. He converted many and performed miracles. One morning, before dawn, he took some of his followers to a place to pray. Then he ordered them to dig a grave as deep as his height in the form of a cross. He had them cover him with earth to the neck. They kissed him for the last time and placed a napkin over his face, wept bitterly and then covered him entirely. Others soon after, on hearing about this, dug up his grave and found nothing. The legend is found in "The Great Collection of The Lives of the Saints," translated from the Slavonic edition published by the Christian Print Shop of the Transfiguration Alms House in Moscow in 1914. It was translated into English by the Chrysostom Press, P.O. Box 536, House Springs, Mo. 63051 in 1994. P.441.

*Polycarp, an early Church Father and overseer of the Church at Smyrna, was one of John's pupils. Polycarp wrote about John the Presbyter or John the Elder as well as John the Apostle. Both Johns were active in the Church at Ephesus.

*Dionysius of Alexander (AD 265) did not believe the Apostle wrote Revelation in view of his reported early death (John had been boiled in oil). He proposed there were two Johns. Eusebius, of Caesarea agreed, one called John the Presbyter and one the Elder. The Elder's death may have been attributed to the Apostle in error. (Encyclopedia of Early Christianity; edited by Everett Ferguson, Garden Publishers., Inc., New York and London, 1990, P.782).

*Irenaeus, friend of Polycarp (AD 115-202), ascribed all five books (Gospel of John, I, II, and III John, Revelation) to John the Apostle and said he was exiled to Patmos. But he also mistook John the Elder for the Apostle. So he and Eusebius, advisor to Constantine, attributed the Book of Revelation to John the Elder. Philip of Side, in AD 430, used this misinformation to place the Apostle's death much earlier than tradition's date of about AD 100...during the reign of Trajan. Some today use this early date to place Revelation prior to AD 70. They then claim the prophecy of Christ's coming in Kingdom Power took place at the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple in the first century!

*Attributing the Elder's death to the Apostle would explain why the latter is the only Apostle for whom no relics have been preserved. In the Greek Orthodox Church tradition, the Apostle, near death, asked that a grave be dug for him in the form of the cross. He was laid in the grave, covered to the neck and a cloth was placed over his face. Later, friends found no body. This legend is recorded in the "Daily Lives of the Saints and the Calendar of Feasts," by Tom Mitrakos of the Orthodox Calendar Co., 3131 Scenic Ct., Allison Park, Pa. 15101.

*The legend is also recorded in a book on "John, Whom Jesus Loved," by Dr. J. Culross (a book so old it has no date of publication by Morgan and Scott of London). He wrote that the belief continued through the Middle Ages. John's remains were sought, but never found. The belief became almost an article of popular faith. The English sect of Seekers, under Oliver Cromwell, expected John to reappear as the forerunner of Christ's glorious coming (P.240). While only a legend, it shows there is no conclusive evidence that John ever died.

*Domitian banished Christians from Rome before he died in 96 AD. John was among them. Under Trajan, from 98 to 117, it was a capital offence to be a Christian. Ignatius, another pupil of the Apostle John, was a martyr during this time. In the first list of martyrs, John the Apostle is not mentioned! (Encyclopedia of Early Christianity, P.742).

*In a book on "The Twelve" by the great Greek and Semitic scholar, published by John Winston Co., Phila., 1957, P.19, Edgar J. Goodspeed, author of over fifty books, says: "There is no record of John's martyrdom." Without such evidence, the Scriptures should be considered. We know of three important passages.

*The most convincing Scripture is that of the two voices telling John in unison: "You must prophesy again before many people and nations and tongues and kings." Rev.10:11. This was after heaven's voice told John to "seal the little scroll" out of which seven thunders spoke. It was after he ate the scroll...sweet to the taste and bitter to the stomach. Otherwise it seems like an uncalled-for ritual without purpose. Nothing John wrote after that required him to "prophesy before many people and nations and tongues and kings" Rev.10:11.

*This ritual may rather be the climax of what John heard and sealed and had eaten to prepare him to help Elijah fulfill the Mighty Angel's word about Two Prophets having been appointed to stand against the Beast for 1260 days to fulfill God's Kingdom Power. John wrote about their future task which climaxes 3 days short of the Lastday...shortly after Trump Six has "passed by." "In the days whenever Trump 7 is about to sound, all things will be finished, as told to Daniel, concerning the mystery of God " Dan.12:9; Mark 9:1; Rev.12:10; Rev.10:6-7!
Mel
lastday
 
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Re: APOSTLE JOHN MAY NEVER HAVE DIED

Postby lastday on Sat Oct 31, 2009 8:28 pm

Peggy wrote:
Thanks, I checked the site out. I never heard John may have never died, always heard he was boiled in oil.

In Rev. 10:4
Are, the two witnesses, the two olive trees and two candlesticks which
stand before the Lord, the same ones mentioned in Zeck. 4:3 ? Thanks
Peggy
lastday
 
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Re: APOSTLE JOHN MAY NEVER HAVE DIED

Postby lastday on Sat Oct 31, 2009 8:35 pm

Peggy,

John was boiled in oil; but after writing Revelation he resided in Ephesus.
The 2 olive trees in Zech.4:11 and Rev.11:4 must have similar purposes.
John will represent the NT Saints and Elijah will represent the OT Saints.

Note that, if this is so, the Rapture of the Church should not occur prior
to the Resurrection of the Two Witnesses who rise up on the Last Day!
I think Jesus will "raise up all believers on the last day" during Seal #Six
and the Two Prophets will rise up first for the Tribunal of Seal #Seven!!
After the Verdict of the Angel of Fire based on the evidence of just 6 of
7 Trumpets presented before God, a 7th Angel blows the Last Trump!!!

PreWrathers do not believe ALL martyrs must rise up on the same day!
That's why they refuse to accept "holy ones" of I Thess.3:13 as Saints!!
PreWrath/PostPlague Rapture lets Jesus "gather ALL Saints in one Day!!!

The difference comes from not seeing the Day of the Lord as a single day!
PreWrathers add an unknown number of "days" for the Day of the Lord!!
The Day of the Lord occurs during the 6th Plague as well as 6th Seal!!!

The 6th Trumpet slaughter of 2 billion people will precede the 6th Plague
as the Evil Trio gathers vast armies into Israel to destroy God's people.
In using the word during I include Seal #6 and Plague #6 on the same
last day. I see the 7th Seal and 7th Trumpet occurring as the 7th Plague
suspends in the air. (At the 7th Trumpet, God immediately executes His
wrath upon Babylon the Great...soon to follow with the wrath of Rev.19:15).
Mel
lastday
 
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Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 11:29 pm


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